The Cybersecurity Advice That Seems Obvious But Most People Ignore | Root To CISO Podcast

 If you want to grow fast in cybersecurity, put yourself in situations where you’re forced to learn.

In this episode of Root to CISO, Kris sits down with Adam Robertson, VP of Enterprise Technology & Information Security at Virgin Galactic, to break down what his cybersecurity career journey looks like. He had no perfect roadmap, no textbook progression, just real decisions, real risks, and real growth.

From starting out as an apprentice and getting made redundant during the dot-com crash… to breaking into cybersecurity through certifications, landing a SOC role, moving across industries, and eventually stepping into executive leadership — Adam’s journey is anything but linear.

They get into:

• How he broke into cybersecurity without a degree
• How certifications opened doors for him early on
• The real role networking plays in landing leadership opportunities
• Why “luck” sometimes matters, and how to create your own
• What consulting teaches you that full-time roles don’t
• Why mastering the basics matters more than chasing trends

If you’re trying to get into cybersecurity, grow into leadership, or eventually become a CISO, this episode gives you a real-world perspective on what it actually takes.

No shortcuts. No perfect plans. Just consistent learning, smart moves, and putting yourself in the right rooms.

🎧 Part 2 drops next week — make sure you’re subscribed so you don’t miss it.

#RootToCISO #CyberSecurity #CISO #CyberSecurityCareer #InfoSec #CareerGrowth #TechCareers #CyberSecurityJobs #Leadership #CyberSecurityTips 

Transcript

Speaker 0:00

Hi, and welcome to the Root to CISO podcast. It's me, Kris Rides. I'm gonna be your host and I'm gonna be chatting to seasoned chief information security officers about their career journeys. We're gonna be unencrypting their real life stories and searching for the hidden keys to help you fast track your cybersecurity career.

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 0:21

Here we are with season three. My second guest on here, another really good friend of mine, fellow Brit, Adam Robertson. Adam, nice to have you on board. Thank you, mate

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 0:33

Thanks for having me, Kris. I feel like this is really the first Aussie-only edition, right? Because both of us always get mistaken as Aussies rather than English

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 0:41

Totally. Yeah. Yeah, we should put a couple of shrimps on the barbie before we started this. Couple of Fosters or something. I don't know. The c- the famous, I don't know what it is. As you go west, when I first moved in was in, on the East Coast in New York, everybody knew I was British. And then as soon as I moved, Houston was pretty good for hearing the British accent, but then once I got over to LA and here, it's yeah, Australian central, right?

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 1:09

Yeah. Do you get any other weird ones?

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 1:12

I Aus-, they'll go Australian. I'll go, "No." And they go, "New Zealand?" I'll go, "No." And they're like, "I, okay, sorry, South African." And I'm like, "No." What about you? You had any unusual ones?

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 1:24

I'd say majority-- I think more than 50% is Aussie, then a good amount English, and then you get that like final 5%. I've had South African and then one time someone said, "Hey, are you are you from Switzerland?" And I was like, "No." She said, "You sound like you're from Switzerland." And I thought, I don't know what a Swiss person sounds like in all fairness. So no they sound German essentially. So yeah, I get some random ones, but mainly Aussie then Brit, so not too bad.

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 1:56

That's such a random one, Switzerland. I tell you what I got literally yesterday and it threw me so much that I didn't know how to reply to the person. He was like, "Are you from Georgia?" And I was like, like I was thinking like the country Ge- do you mean the country Georgia in Europe? Or like literally Georgia, like the state? And I was like, and he looked at me and he was like, "Yeah." Didn't answer the either way. And I was like, "Oh, I'm English." And then he was like, "Oh, okay." So I don't know where that came from

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 2:26

It always good to get a random call out though, isn't it?

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 2:29

Yeah, indeed. But mate, let's crack on with this. Thank you so much for chatting me. We've known each other for years but I know for sure we're gonna find out a whole bunch more about your career, stuff that we just probably have never got round to talking about. You're obviously over at Virgin Galactic right now. Do you wanna let everybody know what you're currently doing?

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 2:47

Yeah, absolutely. My title is VP of Enterprise Technology and Information Security. So I oversee the enterprise technology and information security department. Pretty much anything and everything related to InfoSec rolls up to me at some point. We do collaboration with the risk department and legal department as expected. but yeah that's my main responsibilities.

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 3:11

Nice, nice. We've known each other for a while, but I think great place to start is back even before we knew each other, way back.

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 3:21

How long till we

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 3:22

yeah, let's start at school and go up from there. How did you What were you studying? What did you do, first of all?

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 3:28

Yeah, sure. I grew up in Reading in Berkshire. I went to school there. Don't know what they're called these days, but I still call them GCSEs. I don't know if they've changed names, but yeah, I've,

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 3:40

Yeah.

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 3:41

my- aging ourselves

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 3:42

Yeah, we are

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 3:43

So went through the standard kind of UK school system through GCSEs, which is equivalent to probably what sophomore year, is it? No.

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 3:53

I'm trying to think. Yeah, like what? 17, right? We're 17

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 3:59

yeah.

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 3:59

year old, so yeah

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 3:59

Then I stayed at my school and did A levels, so sixth form college A levels. Kinda nerdy stuff, maths or math, physics, design technology. And then after that I just to get into the workforce. I didn't go to uni. Ended up doing, What did I do first? Actually, God, you're testing me now. Did an apprenticeship. So I

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 4:20

Huh?

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 4:20

Networks at the time. Yeah. Who were big back then,

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 4:24

Yeah

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 4:24

Yeah right before the dot-com. joined them as an apprentice, continued studying, doing things around telecommunications. But also the way it was structured then was three weeks one week at college. And so I did that. I think it lasted about a year, and then the whole world collapsed from a technology perspective. Actually got made redundant from that at the age of about 18 or 19.

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 4:53

That was the dot com bubble bursting, was it?

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 4:55

Yeah, exactly. So then after that I went to British Telecom. I did have a couple of temp roles in between, just random stuff. But then I did an apprenticeship with British Telecom in, in the UK. Similar thing, it was a, three weeks working, one week a month studying. So went to a different college Stoke-on-Trent College, did some studying there, again with and then when I completed that, I was in full-time working, right? No, week per month at college.

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 5:29

Yeah

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 5:32

from there I, I wanted to maintain kind of, my learning, right? So time I thought what was I interested in when, during that, those college what did, what was interesting to me? And it was networking, right? Computer networking. and so back then I started studying for a CCNA, think Cisco Certified Network Associate.

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 5:57

Yeah

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 5:57

I started doing that. I think it took me probably about a year or two, I can't remember exactly. And during that time, I was still hungry for more. I still wanted to keep learning and the kind of natural progression with Cisco certifications at the time was that, the associate and then the professional, and then you get the expert, right? So the time I was like I'd love to get to CCIE. That'd be amazing. It might take me another five, six, seven years, but something to aim at." But as I was learning a bit more, I realized Cisco offered a CCSP, is the security professional. Obviously that means something different now. It's like cloud. Yeah.

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 6:35

Yeah. Yeah. It's the CCSP. Yeah, it's the ISC2's cloud one, right? Along with CSA. Yeah.

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 6:44

All that information you've got now. Exactly. So I started studying for that, and that at the time was made up of, I think, like five modules or five areas, whatever it was called. And so I went through that. Again, that took me two or three years maybe, I can't remember. But right towards the end of that, I'd maybe done or four modules, and I had one or two left, and that's when I actually moved over to the States. So I finished my CCSP actually when I got to America, into California. And that was it really. I... That was my initial break into the infosec world was actually doing the Cisco CCSP. And when I came over to the States my first full-time job here was with Experian, and I worked as a SOC analyst in their GSOC. and when I was going for that job can't remember how I learned it, but I heard of a CEH Certified Ethical Hacker, and I was like, that sounds cool." It just sounds... So again I started self-studying for that. Went through that process, got that certification, and then when I joined Experian, the certs, the experience, all that started rolling up rolling together. I stayed at Experian for a few years working in the SOC for three or four of those years, I think. And then probably for the last year and a half or so with, with- in my Experian days, I moved into a more business side security analyst role. So instead of being a security operations analyst, it was more of a security analyst where, you're doing vendor reviews. The company wants to implement a new tool or a project, and they need like a security perspective on it to make sure that, they're doing it right, that type of thing. So th- those years at Experian were really my foundation, right? The five, six years, I just learned loads and a lot of it was self-learning, but a lot of it was on-the-job learning. But that's really where it kicked off. And from there, I've gone to different companies,

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 8:42

let me ask you, let me stop you there for a second 'cause I I'm interested in a few things there. W- me and you have a very similar background, first of all, right? So I did my GCSEs, I then got my A-levels, math, physics, and chemistry, but I didn't go to, to, to university. I did similar. I went into to, to work. I went into to selling conferences, actually conference space over at Heathrow Airport. We're very close from a, the similar sort of area. And eventually I ended up from there into tech recruitment. I did a little stint while I was doing the conference sales working as their IT assistant. So I touched a little bit on tech, just building internet, like a little internet cafe for them and, turning it off and on basically. That was as far as I got. That was my skill set. But it's interesting. I wonder how much I would love to I'm, I doubtful there's any data anymore, but I would love to be able to go and jump on the old system that my old com- recruitment company worked for because we were based in Maidenhead, which was just down the road from Reading. We covered all of the Thames Valley. And I was working very diligently in tech recruitment back then. And so I bet that we've probably connected at some point or spoken i, we did stuff with Nortel. My dad actually worked with I tried to get in with BT because my dad worked for the whole of his career for BT. But he was on the the literally cabling side of things.

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 10:07

But that's funny because, so yeah, Nortel Networks was based in Maidenhead right off the

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 10:11

Yes. Yeah

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 10:13

where I was for part of it. Same thing, my dad worked for BT for his whole career, 34 years or so. Yeah,

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 10:20

Got nothing when he retired. He was an apprentice at 17 and then retired and he literally got-- I think they didn't-- They might have given him a tie or something. It was terrible, mate, so well, so we never talked about this before.

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 10:30

No

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 10:31

so how did you-- Just 'cause there are a lot of people-- We're gonna talk about a lot of things which a lot of people probably would love to do. I bet there's a whole bunch of probably people that don't live in the States that would love to come and work over here. There's probably a lot of people in the States would like to come work in Europe maybe at the moment. So you know, there's a lot of that. How did you end up-- Oh, obviously I've got my own story of how I ended up over here, but how did you end up making that move and getting over? 'Cause it's not as simple as it sounds for most people, right?

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 11:01

No it's not. It's definitely not. I feel like it's probably harder now than it was when you and I did it, to be honest. I've been here, I think I'm at about eight- 18, nine- 19 years this December, I think I am. So it's probably a lot easier back then. Originally I met my now wife in England. she was actually born here in Los Alamitos, California. But her mum is English, and so she spent a lot of her time between England And so we met when she was over there. Got together, did a bit of long distance, got engaged, got married. Got, g- got engaged, moved over, got married, I should say. That's the correct order. So in a way it was an

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 11:47

Just in case ISIS is listening to this, right?

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 11:50

I guess that's easier. I'm not suggesting everyone goes and does that for green card purposes, but it's probably easier a genuine, legitimate path like that than it is to, try and get a work sponsorship these days for-- You know, and I'm not a specialist in that, but it does seem that trying to get a sponsorship is a little bit more tricky over the last few years. Yeah. Yeah.

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 12:12

Yeah, I'd agree with you. I think I think especially the last few years where there's there's been quite a few layoffs and there's more people from the States that are here looking that maybe have green cards and and are US citizens. Part of getting a visa is distinguishing the skill set you're bringing over they can't hire here in the country. That's a challenge. I came over with a company, a U- UK company or a company originally born out of the UK that had a US office, and so I did it that way and transferred across as one of their executive leaders. And so I came across on a visa and had, internal knowledge that was pretty proprietary. So for me it was, at the time it was easier. I think it's probably a bit harder now. But yeah, it is a challenge. We get asked that question quite a lot, "I really wanna come and work there. I've read about the skills gap and this is what I do." But it is a challenge to, get a H1 and get these other visas and come across. I do think the easiest ways right now is to work for a company that gives you the opportunity to do that. It's probably still the easiest way to do it, or fall in love with an American or vice versa and marry them. I joke because I was a US citizen when I married my wife, so I always say that she married me for her green card despite us both being from England originally. Probably shouldn't do these jokes on, in public on podcasts maybe. Some people take some stuff way too seriously, right?

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 13:32

Exactly

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 13:33

but that's good. Yeah, it's, it's a long journey. And so you came over here straight to California when you were when you were working over here in the SOC?

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 13:42

Yeah, exactly. Orange County, California the whole time. Landed, Huntington Beach, then we went to Orange for a little bit, then to Irvine, and then Anaheim Hills. E- especially in

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 13:53

Yeah

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 13:53

of American things, it's hardly moved basically. But yeah, it's been great. It's hard to beat Orange County

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 13:58

Yes. It's like Reading-on-the-Sea really, isn't it?

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 14:03

I-identical.

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 14:05

I love Orange County. Obviously lived for a long time in SoCal and whenever I come over there and see you and see my other p- friends in Orange County, it's always, I always do feel that tug of the weather's perfect, the beach is right there. It's a great place to be. Look, so you went through, you w- you were working in a SOC, you then went into more of the out of the operations and more into the business side of things. Yeah, tell me more about your career from there.

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 14:31

Yeah, so I, I might forget the order of it, but

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 14:35

when was your first leadership role, like team leader or manager?

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 14:40

That was probably around 2016, 2017. So I went from-- At the time when I was at Experian, they wanted to again, this, I feel like I go through all these financial crisis situations,

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 14:54

We all did.

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 14:55

but back then they wanted to looking at moving the majority of IT function their location in Allen, Texas. I was offered a, an opportunity to relocate, and they gave us some money for moving expenses and I spoke to the wife about it, and it was no. We're not doing

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 15:18

That's an easy no. Yeah. Texas or the beach here in Orange County, yeah.

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 15:21

to use actually. Then I moved over to AAA, which was literally a next door neighbor there, five minutes away from where Experian's at. And then there I think I was a infosec engineer there. Then I did some consulting, with Protiviti,

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 15:39

Yeah

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 15:39

from there moved over to Re- they're called Reliance now, Reliance Steel and Aluminum, or Aluminium I should say, 'cause I'm in the right presence here. I was a, I was an infosec engineer there as well. And that was my first stint with them because I left there for the first leadership role, and that was with a smaller company. About probably 600 people max around that time. And I took on the first leadership role, VP of IT and security. Feels like I've, I haven't really progressed now in the last 10 years. Now I have the same title. Yes. Yeah, exactly. So yeah, that was the first time. So back then it was, I think

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 16:14

Titles don't tell the whole story. That's why we do this podcast.

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 16:18

that was around 2016, 2017, first leadership role. And from there, yeah, it's been, a couple more leadership roles than that. But and I say my first stint at Reliance because after... or sorry, I stayed in that first leadership role with Incipio Group for about three years. And, they ran into challenges and so I ended up going back to Reliance in a leadership role. that was fantastic. I was for five and a half, six years or so in that leadership role.

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 16:50

A question about, so just, so when you, did you move straight into a VP role? It was obviously a smaller company, but were you infosec engineer straight into a VP role? 'Cause obviously that's, in title anyway, that's obviously quite a big jump and that's a challenge that a lot of the people, will listen to this and a lot of people we speak to have, like getting that first manage- management job is a tough gig. And even more so I would say when you're moving jobs 'cause you've got internal people competing for the job, you've got external people that are already managers, right? But is that how you moved to there? And then if so, what do you think were the things that helped you do that?

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 17:32

Yes, I-- it's a good one. And actually, this is probably gonna tie into other questions later on, I'm sure. And I'm just gonna be harping and preaching to the choir here, but network, honest. From that, individual contributor role at Reliance and then you're, like I say, a relatively huge jump, right? In terms of title at least. But you're talking about Reliance is a Fortune 250 company, talking about a company that's, hitting maybe 600 people max, right? That's a huge difference. And to your point you just made, titles mean different things at different places, right? So- Yes. The reason I got the opportunity was I knew the founder and the owner of that company. He knew me as well. So we knew each other. knew what I could do. It wasn't just a kinda like, "Hey, I know you. Here's the job." It's kinda... He knew that I could do that job, I got lucky, and I know that, and I appreciate that he gave me that opportunity. And once you get that title, regardless of where it's at, like company size-wise, is really your foot in the door. And yeah, like I said, I told people in Micro, I said, "There's an element of luck to everything," right? Hard work does pay off, but no one that's made it all the way purely on hard work, right? It just doesn't work like that. It's 90% hard work, 10% luck, you might have one of those jammy mates that has 10% hard work and 90% luck. But

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 19:02

Yeah.

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 19:03

at the end of the day it's a mixture of or a combination of both, right? So I, I was fortunate at the end of the day to get that first role.

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 19:10

I, the thing is, and you're not the only one that talks about this, but we-- I do hear I have quite a lot of the people talk about luck. And I, we, I always say stuff like, "Make your own luck," and luck is when what? Preparate- timing meets preparation and stuff. But I am a believer that when you do start looking back at that, the luck of getting that is to do with the hard work you've put in. It is to do with how you're viewed by people and like how you act around people, right? It good-- and I know you're somebody that does this as well but good management and look at the people they've worked with before, right? It's so common for people to bring in staff that they've hired elsewhere again to work with them because they enjoyed working with them. They know they can trust them. They know they can do the job, right? And so networking is so important and we'll call it luck, but the truth is that luck, usually when people are talking about luck, they're being quite modest about a lot of the other stuff they were doing in the background to make that luck happen, right?

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 20:14

Yeah, that, that's true. I guess I'm too Britishly humble to say that. But I, yeah I got that obviously as my first kind of, big boy title, so to speak. And then Reliance was looking for a director of InfoSec. And I left there on good terms the people I worked with, not just within the team, but teams. the hiring manager who was the, essentially the CIO. Yeah, she gave me the opportunity at the end of the day. We... I got hit up by someone else. They said, "Hey, I've heard you're on the market." And I was like yeah. Let's, have some lunch," whatever. and it all panned out, right? We went through the interview process and stuff. So it's that element of luck, but I think to your point, it's fair. That opportunity wouldn't have been... That, that lucky opportunity wouldn't have been there if I didn't make the right impression the first time round. And I feel like that was probably an even bigger element of luck to it because saying you've worked for a Fortune 250 company at a director level or above is, it's a nice gold star on the resume, right? There's a different... like you say, like a director of Fortune 250 versus a VP of start- 500 employees. Titles don't mean anything when you look at it like that. But,

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 21:33

Yeah

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 21:34

yeah, I, again, there's an element of luck to it, but it was all a good experience.

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 21:38

Yeah, good. Okay, and then moving on from there getting towards, starting to get towards where we are now

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 21:45

Yes. Yeah, we're getting closer. So yeah, then after leaving Reliance, that was when I got my first CISO or CISO title. and that was with TP-Link.

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 21:57

Yeah

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 21:57

So I headed up there. Same thing actually. What I found is, it- apart from the Reliance role, it's always kinda like IT and security for, at least for me. I know that's not true everywhere. So went to TP-Link as their CISO of a- and overseeing the IT technology department as well. and then that, after that I'm where I'm at now. So I've been with Virgin Galactic for seven and a bit months. Joined there last Oct- late last October. And that's it. That's my, my, my 20 years in a nutshell.

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 22:30

You're making it you're making it seem very straightforward and easy, and I know that there's gonna have been some ups and downs in all of that sort of process. We've known each other for a long time. We've worked together for many times. I've seen and been there through a lot of that stuff. If you look back at your whole career now, were there any sort of points where you could say like that was like a major inflection point, or that was a hockey stick like moment for me? Yeah, when you look back or even challenges where you've looked and you say I've ta- I've taken a step back at this point, but I took that because these were the moves I needed to go forwards"?

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 23:06

I don't know. I don't-- I wouldn't say so. There's certainly been lateral but I'm not sure about taking that, step, the, like the catapult, right? Pulling it

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 23:17

Yeah

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 23:18

to excel. I, I-- not for me, I wouldn't say so, but definitely lateral for sure. But I guess in a way, there's that expectation that lateral move will eventually propel you further, but I wouldn't necessarily say for me the pullback. It's more of the sideward with the expectation of trajectory.

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 23:38

But I think even that sidewards a good, it's a good point to talk about, right? Because most people will have that, right? It's really common, and I think s- some people feel like every career, like their career was continually moving forwards, and if they're not moving forwards, it's not successful or it's not the right move or, th- these are the, these are some of the things when we're talking to candidates about, like they, they're consciously a- thinking about that when actually lateral moves can do a lot of good for you to get you set up. And some things that look like a move back or a lateral move, aren't when you start taking on board things like company sizes, right? And, the amount of interaction you'll get or like the stuff you're dealing with at companies, right? Some companies are dealing with all sorts of different issues and different problems or in different a- industries, and that builds up a whole lot of experience that, many other people won't get to to go through.

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 24:36

Yeah. Which I'm trying to think how to answer that.

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 24:40

I guess it's not really a question really. I'm making a statement there, aren't

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 24:42

yeah, I know. I just

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 24:44

But you talked through being like a consultant, like at times you were consulting, right? And that's an interesting part even to talk about 'cause I at some point I was, I, I was helping as a a tech recruiter, I helped build consulting teams, so we did a lot of contractor work. And here in the States, you don't tend to see... I actually, we're starting to see now in the current market, starting to see more contractor roles come up, more consulting roles come up. And that might be because there are more people available because of layoffs and stuff like that, and so people are being a little bit more open-minded about the type of work they take. But I, I feel like you can learn a lot through those contracting roles, and you have to be ready to really jump in and learn new things and grab new environments and connect with people very quickly. So I think that's often quite a good learning point. I don't know whether the stuff that you went through there, there's any particular stories or anything at all that you can think of that's worth sharing?

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 25:43

Yeah. I would definitely echo the sentiment there that when I was doing consulting, you just learn so much. You just do because you can get a call on a Friday night from the boss, you gotta be in such and such state by Monday morning, 8:00 AM, right? And you don't really have any background. It's just, "Hey, we need a security assessment." You think, "That's a little bit vague." But, you're pushed into the fire. And sometimes that can be scary. It is scary, but you have to learn so quickly. And so being a consultant, even for, if you did it for a year or two years or three years, you gain so much knowledge. Just compliance, operations, the whole thing, right? So there's definitely very good advantages to being a consultant. Obviously it can be hard if you have young family and you've gotta travel all the time, so it's not for everyone. But, maybe that's my advice for younger generation, right? It's if you wanna learn quickly and you wanna learn a lot, give it a go. Before you have kids, before you get married, before you own a house, before you have commitments, spend the time traveling. Get to see the world, or at least America and get that experience 'cause you, you'll just learn so much. N- not that you don't learn a lot from to an individual company, right? You absolutely do, but that company does things their way, right? When you go to 10 different companies, you now see 10 different ways to do the same thing, so you just have a lot more of a broader perspective and then your ideas become more valuable, right? You say, "I've seen it done this way, wasn't very good. Seen it done that way, it's fantastic." So you're providing a lot of value to the business just from, flying around the count- around the country.

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 27:29

And there is a, you're right, there is a point in your life you can only do that for certain points. So we see a lot of that. We'll see candidates that come to us when they're working for consulting companies and they're like, "Look I l- loved the travel. I've learned an awful lot, but I'm now looking to settle down." And some of those people are, "I will take a lower salary to enable me to not have to travel quite as much," or, "I don't mind traveling, but I only wanna travel this much of my time because I have a family, I've got, commitments now and I need to be more stable." So yeah, I think there's a lot of opportunities in doing that. I definitely think people need to be very open-minded and the way you describe it, is also probably the time in and around now is also the sort of time where you can do the consulting or even the time to think up ideas, use AI and start building businesses, right? Utilize what you've learned in your career so far and, same, if you can, if you're able to m- make that jump and do it, then now could be exactly the right time to do that. I wanna also think about like your last If you think about the last sort of few jobs that you've had in your last, your career moves Reliance, that sector has been crazy recently, right? So you've worked in some in- really interesting industry sectors. The role at TP-Link, to be building a brand-new US headquarters and a full cybersecurity team. People dream of doing, building something like that, cybersecurity and IT, like on a greenfield site, right? That's something that, you know, with all the pressures that come with working with a company that, that, a b- a cutting off and building out from a Chinese company, that stuff has probably been a lot where you can learn and build on that. And now you're in space. You're like, you're working in the most I feel like the stuff you're working in right now is the stuff that's all over the news. So like, how do you

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 29:24

true

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 29:25

take, yeah, how do you take all that different industries and how do you apply and what could you take from each one and apply to the next one?

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 29:33

Yeah, that's a good question. It's funny because I'll come back to the question, but I often see, like when you look at certain industries, will literally only hire people with experience from that industry. we, we probably all know what industries those are, right? And I always wonder why, when you do that, you're just hiring for the same mindset, right? The same ideas. And you're not necessarily gonna, as a company, you're not gonna change if you repeat what's already been done. I haven't, and obviously to your point I've been across many different industries from, whether it's space to, to, to steel manufacturing and fabrication or home routers and IoT devices. Ultimately, for me, I just feel that i know it's different, and I'm gonna probably contradict myself by saying this, but it's the same, right? It's still you need to do the basics. I'm a big, fan of just do the basics well. The fancy stuff is gonna change by industry, but the basic stuff doesn't, I would say in terms of transferring the knowledge from, one business or one industry to the next it hasn't been that hard for me only because, again, like you, you look at frameworks, right? Industry frameworks, and they can still apply to any industry. it does get a little bit different when, like with TP-Link, for example, you have... you're selling home devices globally, and now you're talking about data privacy laws across countries. That's very specific, very different than just doing something here in the US. But again, cyber hygiene, I still think that is be good at the basics, understand the fundamentals, rinse, repeat, and as you go through, if you're fortunate enough to get into different sectors to get that extra experience, you pick it up, right? You're just transferring this knowledge. Oh you change the terminology, and you change a little thing, and now it's the same. But I find that, the industry more on the healthcare side is I don't think they have that mentality. And maybe there's a reason behind it, right? I don't know. But I find that's one of the harder industries to get into and out of, because they just want the same experience. And I think fair enough, if you repeat what you've already done, you're not gonna really progress.

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 31:47

Yeah. Yeah, I think there's a lot to be learned by transferring knowledge and having different ideas and, we can certainly talk about diversity and with diversity within industry and diversity within experience has got to be useful, especially as a lot of ideas and a lot of industries can be further forward or can look at things from different angles so they can bring that in. So yeah, I love that. Look, now is a good time for us to end part one. We're not gonna go and pretend by changing shirts that we're gonna record a different day for part two. But everybody out there, you're gonna have to wait a whole week, whereas we're gonna continue on to part two and record that now. Everybody else here is gonna be waiting a week for that. I hope you have enjoyed part one. Adam, thank you for joining me so far. And,

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 32:31

me

kris-rides_2_06-05-2026_134110 32:31

yeah, click the button, make sure you subscribe and everything, 'cause then you'll make sure you get part two. So thank you everybody for joining me. Adam, me and you will continue our talk shortly.

adam-robertson_2_06-05-2026_134109 32:42

Looking forward to it

Speaker 32:44

Thank you for listening to the Root to CISO podcast. If there's something you really want me to ask on the next episode, or if you're a CISO who wants to inspire the next generation, please reach out. I'll leave a URL to my LinkedIn profile and make sure you connect and message me there. We're always looking for feedback, so please don't forget to like, comment, and subscribe wherever you get your podcasts.